BTS Press Conference

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

So this is my first omona post, so excuse me if it's kinda off...lol. I'm uploading it from my phone because I can't use my computer right now. No one was uploading the press conference so I decided to do it because like last time I felt like BTS were asked more interesting questions.

Like the first press conference these interviews obviously give off a different vibe from any other interview BTS usually does. But anyways, the questions that stood out to me was the censoring of 내가/니가(naega/niga) and the death threats that Jimin got. First of all, I'm glad they were asked about censoring 내가/니가(naega/niga)and RM's response. I'm probably reading too much into it but it's nice to know (as a black fan) that they took our feelings into consideration when they didn't have to (since it is a Korean word) but did anyways since we are often neglected in Kpop. I know I can be hard on RM a lot but I do feel more respect for him for answering and explaining well to the reporters why they felt it was necessary to censor it. Although it's a sensitive topic I did also find it interesting that they asked Jimin about the death threats. He responded very maturely to the whole thing but you still can't help but worry even though he's is telling us not to.

Anyways that's my take on the press conference. What questions did you find interesting omona? Are you as proud of BTS as I am?!?

Source: JL_Klovely

Comments

[pearlychoco.livejournal.com]

congrats on your first post, op! :)

i'm not a BTS fan, but as a black k-pop fan, i'm glad that they took our feelings into consideration and not say it. other groups should follow.

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

It's not that I don't think they should say the Korean word,I just thought it was thoughtful that they took that into consideration that people may misinterpret the meaning. Maybe I wasn't clear in what I said but they didn't actually say the word.

[jaelissi.livejournal.com]

Without having seen the press conference, on the naega/niga thing: I would be happy with as much as due diligence. I think it's ridiculous to expect a Korean act to censor a Korean word in a Korean song. If they do stuff like this, people might come to think that it's fans and black fans who have demands that are unreasonable when we just want them to educate themselves and not be ignorant

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

But no one expected it though it's just something they decided on their own. I'm not sure what would have happened or if anyone would have even noticed that the word sounded similar if they didn't censor it. But yeah totally agree with where your coming from. I guess for me it's like okay maybe they are at least trying lol though there are better ways to go about it.

[queenhinata.livejournal.com]

as a black bts fan, who's known kpop for almost a decade:

namjoon is truly an exception. or the ideal.

quite unfortunate that fans, non-fans, and antis give him so much shit on a daily basis when he's one of the few idols who have learned from his mistakes, verbally acknowledged it, AND has changed.

about the N word / naega censorship: it's a mixture of wanting to be respectful/cautious for fans and american general public. as well as columbia records having a hand probably. i (and other fans) have mixed thoughts about it tbh.

btw here's a nice compilation of how namjoon has learned: https://onehallyu.com/topic/632452-bts-rm-owning-upto-mistakes/

[mortkero.livejournal.com]

Thanks for sharing, I've not been a big follower of BTS so lack a bit of context. What was the misogyny stuff about? What happened?

The first time I came across Namjoon was on this variety show with Jackson, I thought he came across quite well, so nice to know he is a decent guy, unlike all the good you hear about in the news who turn it to be trash

[queenhinata.livejournal.com]

no problem. i don't think even many fans know about the details x_x hence why/how namjoon gets dragged. unfairly so. in 2018.

misogynistic lyrics.

the ones in question i believe are
- war of hormone | the most "offensive". it's very juvenile and from the perspective of a teen boy (bts' average age back then). you can look up lyrics on colorcoded.
- cypher 3 | "While men smoke cigarettes and women cheat for 2017 concert, namjoon changed the lyric to → While some smoke cigarettes and some cheat)"
- converse high | talks about ideal type of woman, someone who likes/wears converse
- miss right | truthfully i can't find fault in this song. ifans liked it because it was inclusive and we they perform it, the venue back screen shows women of different colors/races. video link (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UL0ECRo-rks)

basically years old lyrics were pulled in question by some people. the accusations occurred in 2016 (these songs are from 2013/2014). the accusers aren't related to feminists. because if they were, other kpop song lyrics would have been brought up to light as well. (as an ex-infinite fan, i can think of the song "an inconvenient truth" that's as bad or worse than any of these bts lyrics). these accusations (https://onehallyu.com/topic/374-international-superstars-koreas-national-pride-%CF%9F-bts-beyond-the-scene-official-thread-%CF%9F-sickofthisfakelove-%CF%9F/page-5150#entry15330479) came before bts were considered a top group in korea, btw. another post from that year, korean speaking fan (https://onehallyu.com/topic/374-international-superstars-koreas-national-pride-%CF%9F-bts-beyond-the-scene-official-thread-%CF%9F-sickofthisfakelove-%CF%9F/page-5151#entry15334037)

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

Oh God...I remember that. I love infinite but that was horrible. I couldn't believe they actually performed it as well on their first world tour...i was in the audience... like really -_-.

[queenhinata.livejournal.com]

yup. i cited infinite because i was a fan so i know their lyrics well, however, kpop has a lot of problematic or gross lyrics that don't get called out. (i mean called out by koreans btw.) i think another example is exo's growl.

only mentioning this because the misogyny accusations were a decisive plan against namjoon by certain people (like i said, not feminists lol. maybe extremists? antis?? whatever. that was 2016).

[yxerin.livejournal.com]

not looking to start shit but.. i think it's wrong to imply that in order for the accusations to have been valid it would've been necessary for them to bring up other sexist kpop lyrics. i read the links you provided and the person's justification for specifically targeting bighit was kind of understandable in a way. bh has marketed bts as being "socially conscious" since the beginning (which is rare in the idol world) and based on the fact that they've made songs abt other social issues it's not that weird for ppl to assume that they would take this sort of thing more seriously than other companies (partly bc it crashes with their brand). just bc they're shitty ppl doesn't mean that the accusations they made weren't sincere. i thought it was weird that they singled out specific lyrics as being misogynist when the problem lied with the whole song n mv, but still.

[mortkero.livejournal.com]

I've just read the lyrics, and they are very questionable!

But yes there are also other songs that take a similar tone.

I think they are right to be called out on it, but the main thing is if they move on from that mentality. I don't follow enough to say either way, but I think being a global brand will sharpen their minds a bit more on such issues and Namjoon sounds thoughtful enough to take it in board.

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

I've seen that thread and to be honest I am one of those fans that can be hard on RM sometimes. He has grown, I'll give him that but my issue with fans is they will say he apologized for things he clearly never apologized for. The west side til I die thing was one of the few things he admitted to being wrong about and that does not all of a sudden rid him of any accountability for the rest of the anti-black stuff he did. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and I'll assume he never address those issues because BIGHIT won't really let him. Since when he did talk about wanting to change on vlive which again people take as an apology for everything when he doesn't even say what he wants to change, he did however say he couldn't talk about it in detail but will later, so I wonder if BIGHIT just told him he can't talk about it. I want to believe the best in him but fans also have to be honest and admit that majority of anti-black stuff he did he has never addressed and probably will never address but yeah I will admit that he's grown and he told a room full of people that he is aware the n-word is offensive whereas he could have put it on the company he said we as in BTS decided to changed it and hobi/suga spent time revising the lyrics themselves. So I don't want to hear that idols don't know what it that words means, cuz its clear they do.

[queenhinata.livejournal.com]

you're allowed to be disappointed or hard on namjoon. just make sure you hold other idols (other bts members, other groups you like or stan) to the same standard, otherwise...that's not fair. unfortunately, there's a lot of people, including fans, who put namjoon on a shit list and never mention anything other bts members have done. makes me question if people/fans like that are "hard" on namjoon because of the problematic stuff or because he's "ugly" ((the answer is: both))

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

Well the only other groups I stan is Infinite and Seventeen. I've dropped groups completely for their behaviors so I'm not the one to do that. I defiantly don't think he is ugly and Jimin, Jhope and him are basically my biases in BTS so I'm defiantly not one of those people lol. But I feel you.

[dbsked.livejournal.com]

I think the issue with Namjoon getting it harder than others is also his image, as he is marketed as smart intelligent member, you would expect more from him.

like I definitely take it differently when V says something dumb and when Namjoon does the same.

[queenhinata.livejournal.com]

i get you...but that's also kinda yikes :S

[bethmai.livejournal.com]

I love these press conferences - their best interviews

[lulufairybubble.livejournal.com]

This happens in English songs as well.

[lulufairybubble.livejournal.com]

Yes but ive even see this happen when somebody didnt curse or anything. When what they said sounded like something else and the track is edited. Through this while thing ive tried to explain to people that the exact same thing happens to English language songs in America as well.

[mlmello.livejournal.com]

I didn't know they did the same type of censoring for words that sounded like something else in english sound. that's why I was so confused with this censoring for fake love. thanks for the information.

[rainstormraider.livejournal.com]

Yeah. It’s not a big deal.

[chikage-chan.livejournal.com]

Thinking from a commercial point of view, the word cersorship was indeed the best decision too. Their objective is to make the song as known as possible to an American audience that has never heard a word in Korean and doesn’t care to search for more information than what’s given to them, so it makes total sense that they would change the song to cater to that audience.

Specially with a word so controversial as that, it’s way easier to just be aware of the implications, change it and avoid a shitstorm that could hinder their future activities.

Namjoon’s answer was very diplomatic and well constructed too, so that’s a even bigger plus. He’s definitely a good example of growing up and changing for the better, and his influence in the whole group really shows.

[nekobot.livejournal.com]

Yeah it's a bit...It's such a dual feeling because on the one hand I'm happy that they're actively thinking about stuff like this, it could be a step in the right direction but on the other...they got this so wrong. I don't think a single black fan asked for this and what we (or at least I) want is for them to learn and address when WE as minorities tell them what actually hurts our feelings and what they should change or keep in mind and (okay sorry Resident BTS Bitter Betty coming in) the fact that they did this makes it even more grating and obvious to me that they're hearing and actively ignoring us when we have other concerns and are actively vocal about them, which makes their nice gesture have the opposite effect of what was intended. They don't have to be perfect, but a simple "wow we messed up here, this is important, this is how we learned and this is how our fans can learn as well" would mean the world and be so much more effective than weird pre-emptive damage control like this.

Taking out naega is, in addition to being misguided (I am all here for calling out anything sketchy but it really is just...a word in this case) also completely not possible to keep up, like what are they going to do, take it out of ALL of their songs for every single concert they play abroad? Does this concept really work or is it really just "we wanted to make sure it was all smooth sailing for our US radio run"? Not to mention I don't want this to be used as some sort of weird standard for other K-pop groups as in your oppas aren't as woke because they just keep speaking their own language in their songs. They pretty much Streisand Effect-ed the word and potentially screwed over their colleagues for not pandering to such an extent in the future.

Idk I'm getting #metoo flashbacks where women are being super clear and open about what they want and need to happen and as a response men are not addressing that at all and getting like...uterus tattoos instead.

It is great that the general usage of the n-word was called out here and we won't have to deal with "oppa didn't know!!" next time an idol uses it anymore because they've officially put it on the table with this so that's an upside to it.

[modestgoddess79.livejournal.com]

I can see non black fans using this to attack black fans in the future as if we asked them to stop speaking their own language. Like we know the difference between naega and the n word. It just makes it looks like actual cultural appropriation is just ethnocentric Americans expecting everyone to cater to us . I can definitely see the me too parallels with women saying stop harassing and assaulting us and men saying they can’t even speak to women at work.
Any new fan can tell the difference. Censoring inoffensive words is just going to confuse people.

[nekobot.livejournal.com]

Exactly, this too. I don't think BTS see it or intend it like this themselves but they are completely speaking over black fans with this and if I may say so, making a joke out of them as if people saying naega is what affects them the most in terms of racism in K-pop. Like there aren't entire volumes of anti blackness in actions and language that have already been addressed many times and this particular "problem" has only ever come up as a thing when it really -was- featured as an n-word surrogate in songs (some YG tracks spring to mind)?

There's also something to be said about the narrative of white fans (the main group that seems to be going "wow this is so great of them", who this gesture is, perhaps unintentionally, catering to) setting a standard where they police poc's language too- both black and asian people in this case.

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

Yeah I commented about this on my tumblr because I already saw fans talking about ethnocentric americans. I basically said although this is not a racism issue... this is also not an issue that pertains to all americans. This is an issue that pertains specifically to black fans, some of whom may not be american. I don't think BTS made the right decision in censoring the word but I can see why they did it. I said if your gonna talk about ethnocentrism, you better not turn around and also praise BTS for knowing what the n-word is cuz I saw a lot of fans doing that too. Overall, I much rather them address the racism in fandom or correct their own mistakes instead of doing this but I can recognize the good intent behind it and I wish fans would just take it as a stepping stone into at least them learning about racism and maybe in future as they continue to grow they will learn what the best way to address these issue are. Like BTS knew what they were doing when they made that decision so fans really shouldn't be attacking anyone because its was their decision, not ignorant americans not understanding Korean. BTS made it clear they weren't gonna cater to the american public and would continue singing in Korean so the fact that they did this means they really felt it was necessary even if I don't personally agree.

[queenhinata.livejournal.com]

black fans didn't ask for this and dw if i see anyone use this "against" black fans, i'll be sure to speak up where it happens

like i said in my comment, i feel like the naega/N word thing is a combination of being cautious/trying to be respectful for american fans and american general public plus the involvement of their new distribution record in america, columbia

It is great that the general usage of the n-word was called out here and we won't have to deal with "oppa didn't know!!" next time an idol uses it anymore because they've officially put it on the table with this so that's an upside to it.

yes

[nekobot.livejournal.com]

From a marketing pov I totally get it, it's more that their explanation of why/how really missed the mark. On the one hand I don't expect them to be able to eloquently talk about this and understand how to get to the root of the problem with this word (which is as important to get across in Korea as it is anywhere else tbh!) so it's not that I think they messed up with this, it's just more of an "ugh, here it goes" knowing how the fans will often twist and turn and misinterpret everything they say to suit their own feelings and narrative (and this is already usually their white fans, who aren't the people who are supposed to be "forgiving" them for amends towards any anti-black behaviour they might have exhibited or contributed to in the first place) and I'd rather it was just left as is rather than talked about in this press con because it comes across as begging for brownie points this way.

Hopefully this is a starting point for improvement rather than another one-off to add to the "international woke things" press list because they obviously made an attempt and should be able to build on that.

[jazzygyu.livejournal.com]

Totally agree with what you said here. I don't like to use this excuse but I feel like BTS in general even with the misogyny stuff (21st century girl happened after all) don't really know what the right way is to address these issues because as an idol they can't say exactly what is on their mind without it being monitored. Like even when listening to their american interviews when they were asked about their fans. Fans gave them props for never saying anything bad about them but at the same time maybe something needs to be said about their behavior but as much as BTS likes to act like they have all this freedom they are super cautious about what they say concerning them and usually will avoid those type of questions in general. I feel like they are trying to find ways to handle the issue without basically getting in trouble for it. I'm not saying it is right but I can understand it I think by doing this although it was a complete misstep they were trying to acknowledge they do hear our concerns...but again they don't know how to approach it correctly I hope as time goes on they will actually grow from this and figure out a better way to address the issue.

But your right about it being such a strange feeling cuz they are actively thinking about black kpop fans and I feel like they've tried before like when they did that interview about "crossing cultures" which was specifically about black fans, or when Hitman Bang talked about their music basically being inspired by black music. They always kinda miss the mark in some ways...Like the crossing cultures interview instead of only the black women narrating the video it would have also been nice to here from BTS and what they thought about what she was saying in the video. And with hitman instead of saying black music he could have said black musicians but I understood even though they missed the mark what they were trying to do and say. They know addressing the issue head on would probably get them in trouble with majority of their fandom because unfortunately majority of kpop fans are asian/white. People like to say BTS has a lot of black fans, and yeah they do but we still don't out number asian and white fans. I've been to their concerts twice when they where in the states one in LA and one in NYC, and I felt like out of the huge line I saw before going in the venue both times...I counted maybe 6 black people in LA and I can't remember for NYC but i remember feeling like I was one of the few black people there. Maybe if I went to the Chicago show it would have been different...I dunno.

[nekobot.livejournal.com]

Yeah you're making some good points that actually make it even more frustrating - we know they can't speak openly and fully give us their own opinions so that actually ends up enhancing the "uhm, so what do you really mean to tell us" factor! It's not their fault that they can't honestly express themselves but now that they're officially in the Western media landscape it has become so frustrating to see and hear. They've become way more idol-like since they went international which means they will not address things if there's a risk for controversy, so it's frustrating when they pull something like this while at the same time being "fake" and keeping mum on real dangerous behaviour (the fan thing you mentioned bugs me so much, people keep falling for them glossing over having their and other fans' lives and safety ruined by some of these fans even though we all KNOW they must get sick to death of them sometimes and are well entitled to not find them perfect supportive angels all the time).

This is also one of the reasons why I am so annoyed that their new Western "friends" all seem to be complacent asshats as well because I feel like the best way for them to genuinely learn and get to a point where they can really do something like this and have it be both effective and sincere is by learning from people that have firsthand experience with this that are willing to talk to them about it. It's frustrating to see that they're willing to put these things on the table but then get it SO wrong - but this is yet another one of the things I think their company is to blame for more than the guys themselves as they don't have space to sincerely talk about these things through trial and error to begin with.

And regardless of how many of their fans are black BTS built have built their brand on black culture and being inspired by black musicians (lots of K-pop groups have, obviously) and I really get the idea that lots of BTS fans, especially the ones that weren't there from the start completely overlook how much they owe their success to black people in that way and will feel like they're being "made" to apologise and make concessions to black fans when really...to be blunt, they owe them!

I also hope this will evolve into them making a better effort as opposed to them getting praised for this and becoming complacent about what a good job they're doing.

[rosiemotleymind.livejournal.com]

Chicago had a decent amount of black fans but you’re right that the majority were Asian and White.

Edited to say: that I think this plays a part with how frustrated/upset with the fandom and the group because we all know that BTS is primarily influenced by black musicians and black culture and AFRICAN AMERICAN culture (so the ethnocentric excuse racist fans try to use shouldn’t fly) that when anti-blackness can’t even be addressed it gets pretty annoying. I’m ok with them feeling like they needed to do this because it does show some form of consideration, I just hope this leads up to getting the balls to talk about other issues that they have.

I agree with a lot of what you’re saying in this post though!

[gigabytexx.livejournal.com]

They are still learning, they have never lived outside Korea and I don't think people in their environment understand it fully either. People will never really feel/experience certain culture if they don't actually live in said country because internet just doesn't enough, unless they're friends with the right black celebrities who can tell them the right way to do this.

I do think they only censoring naega in Fake Love just because they're basically the first Kpop act in such big event and they wanted it to not make people immediately go away with that word, it's like first impression matters more I think? These days people would instantly disregard anything without double-checking, I think it's the best move to censor it in the beginning.

I hope you will give them more time though~