151008 MNET M! COUNTDOWN E446

[kevinmchale.livejournal.com]

Winners Announcement

	GOT7 'If You Do'	IKON 'Rhythm Ta'
Digital Sales (음원 판매 점수)	1924	3267
Physical Album Sales (음반 판매 점수)	1500	0
Viewer Votes (선호도 점수)	632	990
Social Media (소셜미디어 점수)	1500	931
Mnet Broadcast Points (엠넷 방송 점수)	760	880
Final Total	6864	7068

FULL SHOW

Part ONE

Part TWO

COMEBACK STAGES

[ 2BIC — 지금처럼 사랑할게 I Will Love You Like Now ]

DEBUT STAGES

REGULAR STAGES

TEASERS

OTHER CUTS

[ MCD Chart: 10-3 ]

sources: Mnet, Skpb K-Music Live

Comments

[snowyirees.livejournal.com]

Actually, no. Physical beauty is as objective as objective can be. A "visual", in Kpop terminology, refers to superficially perceived beauty by the sense of vision (hence the term in the first place). It cannot be subjective because our brain has been prewired to sense and categorize certain matters and symmetry as "attractive". It's only when you combine it with metaphysical components (personality traits, intelligence, etc) that it comes truly subjective.

Boy groups are part of the entertainment industry, which is largely based on physical beauty. So yes, saving a group filled with physically attractive people is an achievement, especially when talent and personality are not lacking in the group itself.

[lily-of-west.livejournal.com]

Are you Korean living in Korea tho? Is the person I replied to Korean?

The fact that you have to write all this down to prove a point....and again thank god not everyone has the same taste because clearly there are people who think iKON is filled with visuals. So

[snowyirees.livejournal.com]

No idea why you think I digressed from the topic at hand when I replied to you, not the original commenter. You talked about visuals being subjective and not an achievement and I merely replied.

I don't know the person you replied nor their ethnicity. I for one am not Korean, nor am I living in Korea, but again I have no idea how that has anything to do with this considering I was talking about universal aesthetic standards. But if you /are/ that set on the Korean view point, I guess you can just look into all the articles around GOT7's debut with the general public themselves calling them a visual group.

LOL I wrote "all this down" because I study marketing and marketing psychology is based heavily on behavioral and cognitive analysis, including how to use physical attractiveness to have certain behavioral outputs. The widespread belief "that beauty is subjective" is the reason so many people fall in the trap on marketing strategies in the first place. But heeeey, if you wanna think I did it just to argue with you even after I agreed with a point you initially made then go right ahead.

Did I say or even imply iKON doesn't have visuals? Please don't put words in my mouth to make your retaliation look more believable :)

[gray-fairy.livejournal.com]

Physical beauty is as objective as objective can be
Idk about that tbh. You have people that find typical kpop visuals like Yoona or Minho "too plain looking" or even flat out physically unnattractive while finding other people in their groups like Hyoyeon or Onew more physically appealing (I used them as examples because they're considered the opposite from visuals in Korea). I think the way we perceive physical beauty is a mix of our personal preferences and the beauty standards in our respective countries/background, etc. Definitely not objective tbh.

[snowyirees.livejournal.com]

I know it sounds really "iffy" at first (I thought it was a load of bull at the beginning too), but it really has been like that for a very long time and continues to be so. It's not about "more appealing", it's about it being "appealing" in the first place, no matter what the degree. There is more and more research being put out everyday about how intangible universal aesthetic is when it comes to physical beauty (when metaphysical is /completely/ taken out of question). It's almost like its innately ingrained in our psyche. It's all in philosophy.

I do agree that personal preferences and cultural beauty standards can play a part in the presence of variations (for example, the preference of tan vs pale around the world), but even then people prefer the same pattern of facial characteristics and symmetry that have been present for decades (especially the latter). People, regardless of ethnicity, seem to lean towards a more conventional aesthetic. If you show a Chinese person a picture of Deepika Padukone and an average Indian woman, they will pick the former. If you show an Indian person a picture of Fan Bingbing and an average Chinese woman, they will pick the former. Even babies show a bias in this matter, and they are not old enough to be receptive to metaphysical characteristics.

People calling visuals like Minho and Yoona "plain" has less to do with the visuals' physical attractiveness and more to do with the psychological need of the person in question to overcome a personal complex by putting the physical beauty of that visual down. You can find other people more attractive, but saying someone is "unattractive" in the aesthetic sense when everything indicates otherwise like tricking yourself into believing it. I haven't studied psychology in depth so maybe someone else can explain it better.

Sorry for the essay, it's genuinely a very interesting topic to discuss.