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omonatheydidReligious cults are not point here
Many foreigners, especially those hailing from Western countries, seem to digress from the whole point of the Choi Soon-sil and President Park Geun-hye fiasco that has brought chaos to Korea. Although it is understandable that Western media may be overwhelmed with the sudden surge of information uploaded on a daily basis by the Korean media, it is absolutely unforgivable how they have distorted the real issue at stake. Korea is not like the United States or Europe.
There is no national religion or a major religion embedded in the foundation of the country, and there has been none. If anything, Buddhism, shamanism or totemism has a much longer history and relevance with Korea than Christianity. This is a critical fact that needs to be addressed because this is where Western media have gotten it all wrong.
Just to be clear, I have no objections to condemning Choi Tae-min, the father of the now-notorious Choi Soon-sil and creator of the problematic religious cult that gripped President Park Geun-hye, as “Rasputin” as many Western media outlets have done. One thing for certain is that Choi definitely did not start his own religion purely out of the goodness of his heart.
Choi’s religious group came into existence when President Park’s father, Park Chung-hee, gave orders to create a new Christian influence that would weaken progressive Christians who fought against his dictatorship. In other words, scores of Christian groups thrived and divided into new forms of Christian branches as different leaders were elected and politics got tangled up in the process of gathering votes.
Furthermore, Christianity came to Korea only a century or so ago. It is still very young compared to the thousands of years old shamanism. Therefore, it is pretentious for Western media to simply conclude that the cause of the problem is the religious cults. What is the standard that designates a religious group as a cult anyway, and especially in country like Korea?
Korea is famously referred to as a “department store of religion,” and for good reason, too. For many Koreans, shamanism is not a foreign concept, and I have come by quite a few people who call themselves Christians, yet also make frequent visits to shamans’ homes. Also, different religious beliefs can be pursued even among family members.
The reaction and attitude towards shamanism is definitely different from that of Westerners, and this is to be expected. After all, it was not the Koreans who spilled blood over years of religious battles. The conflict between Protestants and Catholics as well as Muslims and Christians (mainly Westerners) seems to be ongoing to this day, as is apparent in the US presidential election, which average Korean citizens would not be able to fully comprehend and probably never could.
A more modern example that clearly shows why Americans would put emphasis on cults and shamanism is “In God We Trust” that is blaringly featured on their currency. To top it off, that phrase is the United States’ motto, and that says it all.
Without the basic understanding of Korean political and cultural history, Western media will keep making the sad mistake of pinpointing the blame of corruption and political disarray on Choi’s family and the rise of religious cults. Any organization, whether it is religious, nonreligious, Christian, Shamanistic, etc., should be penalized and regulated if it deviates from the law or the constitution and harms the society or people.
The people of Korea are outraged by the failed governance of the Park administration and irresponsibility of the president for allowing herself to be reduced into nothing more than a puppet, controlled by some random woman, all the while pretending to be a competent leader to the nation. And this is why Koreans are not talking about religious cults.
Ku Yae-rin,
Student of international relations,
Kyung Hee University, Seoul
Choi Soon-sil, at Center of Political Scandal in South Korea, Is Jailed
SEOUL, South Korea — The woman at the center of President Park Geun-hye’s worst leadership crisis was jailed on Tuesday, as prosecutors grilled her overnight over allegations that she had manipulated important government affairs from the shadows.
Choi Soon-sil, 60, a friend of Ms. Park’s for 40 years and widely seen here as the president’s secret adviser, though she had no official government title, was also accused of using her influence to extort $69 million from big businesses in the form of donations to two foundations she controlled.
On Sunday, Ms. Park fired eight aides, including her chief of staff, in an effort to regain public trust. That was a day after thousands of South Koreans took to the streets to call for her removal from office.
And on Monday, after weeks of evading the news media and public scrutiny, Ms. Choi presented herself to prosecutors. She tearfully apologized before a phalanx of television cameras, while angry citizens demanded her arrest. One person was detained while attempting to hurl a tub of excrement at her and the prosecutors’ office, claiming that the investigation was rigged to protect Ms. Park.
On Tuesday, a man was detained after he drove his excavator through the gate of the prosecutors’ office. He later told the police that he came from a rural South Korean town to kill Ms. Choi.
After hours of questioning, prosecutors said they had decided to “urgently detain” Ms. Choi and locked her away early Tuesday in a Seoul jail. Prosecutors take such a measure when they believe that they have enough evidence for criminal charges.
The scandal involving Ms. Choi was particularly inflammatory in South Korea, partly because of her background.
She is the daughter of a religious leader named Choi Tae-min who is said to have befriended Ms. Park in the mid-1970s with a claim that he could help her contact her dead mother, who was killed by an assassin in 1974. Ms. Park’s father, Park Chung-hee, was a military dictator who ruled South Korea from 1961 until he was assassinated in 1979.
Mr. Choi, a shadowy figure with several pseudonyms, was believed by many to have exercised a Rasputin-like power over Ms. Park and to have used it to collect bribes. He died in 1994.
After Ms. Park took office as president in early 2013, rumors persisted that Ms. Choi exerted an undue influence on Ms. Park, who had few relatives or friends she could trust, to meddle in government affairs, installing her associates in the government and helping them win large government contracts.
Some of those suspicions seemed to be vindicated last week, when Ms. Park acknowledged that she had let Ms. Choi edit some of her most important speeches. Ms. Park’s approval ratings have plummeted to record lows in the past couple of weeks.
Omona, what are some eurocentric/US-centric ideas you challenge and fight against?
Source: Korea Herald | New York Times (+image)
Many foreigners, especially those hailing from Western countries, seem to digress from the whole point of the Choi Soon-sil and President Park Geun-hye fiasco that has brought chaos to Korea. Although it is understandable that Western media may be overwhelmed with the sudden surge of information uploaded on a daily basis by the Korean media, it is absolutely unforgivable how they have distorted the real issue at stake. Korea is not like the United States or Europe.
There is no national religion or a major religion embedded in the foundation of the country, and there has been none. If anything, Buddhism, shamanism or totemism has a much longer history and relevance with Korea than Christianity. This is a critical fact that needs to be addressed because this is where Western media have gotten it all wrong.
Just to be clear, I have no objections to condemning Choi Tae-min, the father of the now-notorious Choi Soon-sil and creator of the problematic religious cult that gripped President Park Geun-hye, as “Rasputin” as many Western media outlets have done. One thing for certain is that Choi definitely did not start his own religion purely out of the goodness of his heart.
Choi’s religious group came into existence when President Park’s father, Park Chung-hee, gave orders to create a new Christian influence that would weaken progressive Christians who fought against his dictatorship. In other words, scores of Christian groups thrived and divided into new forms of Christian branches as different leaders were elected and politics got tangled up in the process of gathering votes.
Furthermore, Christianity came to Korea only a century or so ago. It is still very young compared to the thousands of years old shamanism. Therefore, it is pretentious for Western media to simply conclude that the cause of the problem is the religious cults. What is the standard that designates a religious group as a cult anyway, and especially in country like Korea?
Korea is famously referred to as a “department store of religion,” and for good reason, too. For many Koreans, shamanism is not a foreign concept, and I have come by quite a few people who call themselves Christians, yet also make frequent visits to shamans’ homes. Also, different religious beliefs can be pursued even among family members.
The reaction and attitude towards shamanism is definitely different from that of Westerners, and this is to be expected. After all, it was not the Koreans who spilled blood over years of religious battles. The conflict between Protestants and Catholics as well as Muslims and Christians (mainly Westerners) seems to be ongoing to this day, as is apparent in the US presidential election, which average Korean citizens would not be able to fully comprehend and probably never could.
A more modern example that clearly shows why Americans would put emphasis on cults and shamanism is “In God We Trust” that is blaringly featured on their currency. To top it off, that phrase is the United States’ motto, and that says it all.
Without the basic understanding of Korean political and cultural history, Western media will keep making the sad mistake of pinpointing the blame of corruption and political disarray on Choi’s family and the rise of religious cults. Any organization, whether it is religious, nonreligious, Christian, Shamanistic, etc., should be penalized and regulated if it deviates from the law or the constitution and harms the society or people.
The people of Korea are outraged by the failed governance of the Park administration and irresponsibility of the president for allowing herself to be reduced into nothing more than a puppet, controlled by some random woman, all the while pretending to be a competent leader to the nation. And this is why Koreans are not talking about religious cults.
Ku Yae-rin,
Student of international relations,
Kyung Hee University, Seoul
Choi Soon-sil, at Center of Political Scandal in South Korea, Is Jailed
SEOUL, South Korea — The woman at the center of President Park Geun-hye’s worst leadership crisis was jailed on Tuesday, as prosecutors grilled her overnight over allegations that she had manipulated important government affairs from the shadows.
Choi Soon-sil, 60, a friend of Ms. Park’s for 40 years and widely seen here as the president’s secret adviser, though she had no official government title, was also accused of using her influence to extort $69 million from big businesses in the form of donations to two foundations she controlled.
On Sunday, Ms. Park fired eight aides, including her chief of staff, in an effort to regain public trust. That was a day after thousands of South Koreans took to the streets to call for her removal from office.
And on Monday, after weeks of evading the news media and public scrutiny, Ms. Choi presented herself to prosecutors. She tearfully apologized before a phalanx of television cameras, while angry citizens demanded her arrest. One person was detained while attempting to hurl a tub of excrement at her and the prosecutors’ office, claiming that the investigation was rigged to protect Ms. Park.
On Tuesday, a man was detained after he drove his excavator through the gate of the prosecutors’ office. He later told the police that he came from a rural South Korean town to kill Ms. Choi.
After hours of questioning, prosecutors said they had decided to “urgently detain” Ms. Choi and locked her away early Tuesday in a Seoul jail. Prosecutors take such a measure when they believe that they have enough evidence for criminal charges.
The scandal involving Ms. Choi was particularly inflammatory in South Korea, partly because of her background.
She is the daughter of a religious leader named Choi Tae-min who is said to have befriended Ms. Park in the mid-1970s with a claim that he could help her contact her dead mother, who was killed by an assassin in 1974. Ms. Park’s father, Park Chung-hee, was a military dictator who ruled South Korea from 1961 until he was assassinated in 1979.
Mr. Choi, a shadowy figure with several pseudonyms, was believed by many to have exercised a Rasputin-like power over Ms. Park and to have used it to collect bribes. He died in 1994.
After Ms. Park took office as president in early 2013, rumors persisted that Ms. Choi exerted an undue influence on Ms. Park, who had few relatives or friends she could trust, to meddle in government affairs, installing her associates in the government and helping them win large government contracts.
Some of those suspicions seemed to be vindicated last week, when Ms. Park acknowledged that she had let Ms. Choi edit some of her most important speeches. Ms. Park’s approval ratings have plummeted to record lows in the past couple of weeks.
Omona, what are some eurocentric/US-centric ideas you challenge and fight against?
Source: Korea Herald | New York Times (+image)
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no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 08:50 am (UTC)For what I read it always seemed that the problem was that Park Geun Hye was elected to then later have another woman make the decisions for her.
A more modern example that clearly shows why Americans would put emphasis on cults and shamanism is “In God We Trust” that is blaringly featured on their currency. To top it off, that phrase is the United States’ motto, and that says it all.
O_O I'm just learning about this and it sounds like something that shouldn't be legal, but what do I know?
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:01 am (UTC)It seems like Americans rejected the British royal family, and decided to make God itself their head of state.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:33 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:40 am (UTC)I know it's not mandatory but it's very disturbing
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 11:45 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 12:56 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 04:39 pm (UTC)The 1950s were wild for religious revivalism.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 07:09 pm (UTC)Thomas Jefferson specifically didn't want church and state mingling
I always had the idea that this was a general feeling for a lot of places in the world so it's one of the main reasons I was surprised "God" is on the American currency.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:09 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:27 am (UTC)Just a few articles: like Le figaro had an article about Park Geun-Hye being heard by the prosecution
There was also one article mentionning the "Rasputin" nickname (but it says that the nickname was given by korean media) and it only focuses on the "influence" and corruption, not religious aspect... but France is a laic (secular? that's the word?) country so idk
I feel like I should look into this but I've been so out of it lately, mostly been following the US election, the next french election...
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 12:49 pm (UTC)I think we're more likely to see religion as some side of corruption (or something to disguise it) so shamanism isn't really the focus
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:37 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 10:53 am (UTC)like the articles i read brought in rasputin as he was a random person close to a leader using and abusing his power on that leader....? i mean i'm obviously oversimplifying it due to time constraints now, the point is religion was not mentioned there.
oh well.
very interesting to read this viewpoint anyway.
(also some hungarian articles mention a hungarian parallel story, our prime minister has a sort of ms choi as well, the media is still trying to work out why that guy can manipulate the pm (who also has serious mental health issues).)
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 11:10 am (UTC)It's very rare in the first place to equate Rasputin to a religious figure anyway, he's more of a grey eminence
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 11:15 am (UTC)although most of the things i've read are from omona, i don't think i've seen any of the articles focusing on the religious cult. i think only after this article that i knew it's religious.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 11:29 am (UTC)Like you said, that's not what the Rasputin comparison means either.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 11:32 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-05 03:30 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 11:24 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 12:27 pm (UTC)I've seen comments comparing the pres behavior to that a brainwashed cult member but thats it...
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 12:28 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 12:39 pm (UTC)and how about they talk about the most likely real reason for Park being 'controlled by a random woman' - the reason that Park trusted in Choi in the first place? Her reaction to her mother's death? the way that Korea reacts to mental illness and trauma, hmmm? no? didn't think so.
I'm glad Choi is in prison tho. And PGH needs to do more to appease the people, there's too much anger there for a single apology and removal of government staff to resolve
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 12:52 pm (UTC)I've haven't seen much focus on sects here in France, the corruption is the main topic.
I'm still totally bewildered by this scandal. This have been going on for decades... so many people must have realized it and said nothing.
PGH needs to do more if she wants to regain some trust.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 06:17 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 08:08 pm (UTC)There's really nothing she can do for her political future, but I'm surprised that she doesn't seem to really care about it in the first place. She doesn't even do the bare minimum, especially seeing it's such an important scandal.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 02:18 pm (UTC)Btw people who say that usa's stance on christianity is creepy, you guys should read about the situation in Poland. We are literally ruled by the catholic church and their puppets in the government. I hate this place.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 03:08 pm (UTC)And the fact that it prob was one of the mildest things anybody from his freakin party said lately ...
And the sole fact that this gremlin has no official state position/job yet he decides about everything is so fucking infuriating.
I hate this place too;(
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 03:29 pm (UTC)i literally decided to start another major to get the fuck out of here lmao like i love my family and friends and i am polish and i will always feel that way, but i hate what's happening here, what is allowed and how brainwashed people are by church. there's no way i'm staying here (also i'm mostly gay and want to adopt a kid, imagine that)
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 03:13 pm (UTC)How did that go?
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 03:44 pm (UTC)the protest, whatever anyone says, was a success in a sense that we had a week to promote it, but we managed! and even in the small towns women came to the streets to protest, in some places it was the first time anyone has ever protested anything there (which is honestly incredible). and since foreign press started talking about it PIS (ruling party) got scared. So they called a meeting where they rejected the bill BUT
1) the meeting was unlawful. you're supposed to announce and inform everyone about it at least three days before it happens, they organized everything in one day.
2) opposition, stupidly, went with it because the outcome was what they wanted it to be. they should have demended to organize another meeting because
3) foreign press swallowed that shit and happily announced that everything is fine now! yay women! and stopped talking about it which was a huge blow to our strenght.
not to get too much into details, PiS wrote another bill which will ban abortions in case of a fetus with a defect that will end up with a disability. and the best part is that today they approved a bill which grants 4k zł (1000 EU or sth idk) to a woman who carries a defected fetus (and gives birth to the child obviously) or gives birth to a child conceived during rape. This is so disgusting and degrading, they are literally trying to pay their way out of this.
and i won't even write what all those fuckers were saying in the meantime, because it just makes me want to kill someone.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 04:45 pm (UTC)This is disgusting and I feel so bad for you
wait... are they actually bribing women with that grant???
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:24 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:36 pm (UTC)I may sound naive but this is too much
no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 09:29 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 02:40 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 03:05 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 06:26 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 07:03 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2016-11-04 10:51 pm (UTC)But i mean, western-centrism has been a major problem in general. I know that what always gets my goat is how american news is big for the rest of the world, but american media doesn't really report on other news. it's very frustrating and leads to a lot of ignorance.
no subject
Date: 2016-11-05 12:04 am (UTC)Uh except they are. Every Korean I talked to about this explained the cult aspect of it first. The writer of the first article has a point that the whole story is rarely covered in foreign media (even here too, Korean news cover western news in the way that makes it interesting and consumable to Koreans) but to say Koreans don't care about the cult aspect at all is pretty ludicrous. I know so many people who hate religion because of how corrupt it is here and how influential it is on politics. They know they're all basically cults that operate as businesses. It's not the same as the west but it's still a problem and that's what ive been told by many Korean people themselves. Not to mention these pseudo Christianity cults go out recruiting in other countries too. I think this guy Is just angry that the cult aspect could look a little too "old world" to the west and embarrass Korea.